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	<title>Comments on: The best and the brightest?</title>
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	<description>Dispatches from a legal profession on the brink</description>
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		<title>By: Resolving the legal education disconnect</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-1235&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-1235</link>
		<dc:creator>Resolving the legal education disconnect</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 18:33:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-1235</guid>
		<description>[...] first blush, I agreed with this. I&#8217;ve complained myself about the relatively unsophisticated approaches to recruitment that many law firms still take. The [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] first blush, I agreed with this. I&#8217;ve complained myself about the relatively unsophisticated approaches to recruitment that many law firms still take. The [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Breaking the big firm</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-1139&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-1139</link>
		<dc:creator>Breaking the big firm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 14:14:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-1139</guid>
		<description>[...] diploma.&#8221; But how many firms will risk the CYA comfort of consistently recruiting from &#8220;the best and the brightest,&#8221; let alone make substantive changes to the overall associate [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] diploma.&#8221; But how many firms will risk the CYA comfort of consistently recruiting from &#8220;the best and the brightest,&#8221; let alone make substantive changes to the overall associate [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Blawg Review #218 &#124;</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-956&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-956</link>
		<dc:creator>Blawg Review #218 &#124;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 03:22:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-956</guid>
		<description>[...] of selecting the best and brightest has no actual grounding in finding the true outliers.  In this post by Jordan Furlong supports this idea that the &#8220;best and brightest&#8221; is a fallacy handed to those attorneys [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of selecting the best and brightest has no actual grounding in finding the true outliers.  In this post by Jordan Furlong supports this idea that the &#8220;best and brightest&#8221; is a fallacy handed to those attorneys [...]</p>
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		<title>By: laidoffdiary</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-939&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-939</link>
		<dc:creator>laidoffdiary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 17:46:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-939</guid>
		<description>I think that only using pedigree as a factor in determining the best and the brightest is a cop out because it definitely is hard work to evaluate each possible candidate on his or her own individual merit; however, just because it&#039;s easier to use pedigree doesn&#039;t mean it&#039;s correct methodology. Moreover, only selecting from the same pool over and over leads to homogeny--it&#039;s not good in the gene pool and it&#039;s not good in law.

Here&#039;s a good quote from Nietzsche that sums it up pretty succinctly:

“History teaches that the best preserved tribe among a people is the one in which most men have a living communal sense as a consequence of sharing their customary and indisputable principles….The danger to these strong communities founded on homogeneous individuals who have character is growing stupidity, which is gradually increased by heredity, and which, in an case, follows all stability like a shadow. It is the individuals who have fewer ties and are much more uncertain and morally weaker upon whom spiritual progress depends in such communities, they are the men who make new and manifold experiments. Innumerable men of this sort perish because of their weakness without any very visible effect, but in general, especially if they have descendants, they loosen up and from time to time inflict a would on the stable element of the community….those who degenerate are of the highest importance wherever progress is to take place; every great progress must be preceded by a partial weakening. The strongest natures hold fast to the type; the weaker ones help to develop it further.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that only using pedigree as a factor in determining the best and the brightest is a cop out because it definitely is hard work to evaluate each possible candidate on his or her own individual merit; however, just because it&#8217;s easier to use pedigree doesn&#8217;t mean it&#8217;s correct methodology. Moreover, only selecting from the same pool over and over leads to homogeny&#8211;it&#8217;s not good in the gene pool and it&#8217;s not good in law.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a good quote from Nietzsche that sums it up pretty succinctly:</p>
<p>“History teaches that the best preserved tribe among a people is the one in which most men have a living communal sense as a consequence of sharing their customary and indisputable principles….The danger to these strong communities founded on homogeneous individuals who have character is growing stupidity, which is gradually increased by heredity, and which, in an case, follows all stability like a shadow. It is the individuals who have fewer ties and are much more uncertain and morally weaker upon whom spiritual progress depends in such communities, they are the men who make new and manifold experiments. Innumerable men of this sort perish because of their weakness without any very visible effect, but in general, especially if they have descendants, they loosen up and from time to time inflict a would on the stable element of the community….those who degenerate are of the highest importance wherever progress is to take place; every great progress must be preceded by a partial weakening. The strongest natures hold fast to the type; the weaker ones help to develop it further.”</p>
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		<title>By: Anne</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-935&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-935</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:29:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-935</guid>
		<description>In a mash-up of hoary proverbs, it may be true enough that it’s hard to make a sow’s ear out of a silk purse, but then you oughtn’t to judge a book by its cover, and the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Which is to say that, after all, it’s performance on the job that will determine how many of the grads from the elite schools keep the places they (apparently effortlessly) ascend to upon their apotheosis — oops, graduation. There surely can’t be an endless supply of open-ended positions in “the best” law firms for underperforming associates; in the nineteenth century, of course, one shipped them off to the remotest parts of the empire … I wonder what the twenty-first century equivalent of that would be.

Scalia’s tautology extends well beyond law schools and the firms that sponge up their issue; the administration of my university, while bragging about the accomplishments of its faculty at every opportunity (particularly when research dollars are attached as a handy gauge of excellence), nevertheless suffers from the inverse of the Scalia Syndrome (if I can put it that way). Where the Justice claims that, if an aspirant weren’t one of the “best of the best of the best”, then he wouldn’t be attending an elite school, the administration of my university is nagged by the sneaking suspicion that if its faculty members were really any good at all, we’d be teaching somewhere else — at a good (or at least better) school. It’s the same set of assumptions, but read back to front. And it’s just as wrong — about faculty, about students, and about the quality of education on offer.

It’s hard to keep a good mind down; you really do have to work hard to ruin that silk purse. By the same token, a smart student will flourish in any number of educational environments, since ultimately the alchemy of learner, teacher, environment, curriculum, and style of teaching can’t be reduced to an equation or formula. How do I know that’s true? Because if it was that easy, anyone could do it, and any institution could guarantee the quality and success of its graduates, independent of their (or its) connections, status, prestige, and pull.

Great post, as ever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In a mash-up of hoary proverbs, it may be true enough that it’s hard to make a sow’s ear out of a silk purse, but then you oughtn’t to judge a book by its cover, and the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Which is to say that, after all, it’s performance on the job that will determine how many of the grads from the elite schools keep the places they (apparently effortlessly) ascend to upon their apotheosis — oops, graduation. There surely can’t be an endless supply of open-ended positions in “the best” law firms for underperforming associates; in the nineteenth century, of course, one shipped them off to the remotest parts of the empire … I wonder what the twenty-first century equivalent of that would be.</p>
<p>Scalia’s tautology extends well beyond law schools and the firms that sponge up their issue; the administration of my university, while bragging about the accomplishments of its faculty at every opportunity (particularly when research dollars are attached as a handy gauge of excellence), nevertheless suffers from the inverse of the Scalia Syndrome (if I can put it that way). Where the Justice claims that, if an aspirant weren’t one of the “best of the best of the best”, then he wouldn’t be attending an elite school, the administration of my university is nagged by the sneaking suspicion that if its faculty members were really any good at all, we’d be teaching somewhere else — at a good (or at least better) school. It’s the same set of assumptions, but read back to front. And it’s just as wrong — about faculty, about students, and about the quality of education on offer.</p>
<p>It’s hard to keep a good mind down; you really do have to work hard to ruin that silk purse. By the same token, a smart student will flourish in any number of educational environments, since ultimately the alchemy of learner, teacher, environment, curriculum, and style of teaching can’t be reduced to an equation or formula. How do I know that’s true? Because if it was that easy, anyone could do it, and any institution could guarantee the quality and success of its graduates, independent of their (or its) connections, status, prestige, and pull.</p>
<p>Great post, as ever.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Vuleta</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-932&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-932</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Vuleta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 05:13:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-932</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s definitely interesting to consider the extent to which this applies across different countries.

In Australia for example, geographical distances and jurisdictional differences serve as an effective counter-weight.  

Although graduating from Monash University in Melbourne can be impressive, it&#039;s not of too much impact in Queensland, since most people study locally.   Likewise, most law graduates tend to look for work in their local area first. Therefore, many law firms and judges tend to recruit locally, greatly reducing the competition between different law schools for the &quot;best and the brightest&quot;.  

This might be down to that a lot of law is handled at the State level - the Federal jurisdiction in Australia, while important, is not overly-dominant, and so it is harder to practice across borders.  I don&#039;t know that we actually have the equivalent of a Yale or Harvard.  

I have no real insight into how big law firms here recruit however.  It just seems in Australia we don&#039;t have two dominating law schools as a function of a different geograpical and jurisdictional situation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s definitely interesting to consider the extent to which this applies across different countries.</p>
<p>In Australia for example, geographical distances and jurisdictional differences serve as an effective counter-weight.  </p>
<p>Although graduating from Monash University in Melbourne can be impressive, it&#8217;s not of too much impact in Queensland, since most people study locally.   Likewise, most law graduates tend to look for work in their local area first. Therefore, many law firms and judges tend to recruit locally, greatly reducing the competition between different law schools for the &#8220;best and the brightest&#8221;.  </p>
<p>This might be down to that a lot of law is handled at the State level &#8211; the Federal jurisdiction in Australia, while important, is not overly-dominant, and so it is harder to practice across borders.  I don&#8217;t know that we actually have the equivalent of a Yale or Harvard.  </p>
<p>I have no real insight into how big law firms here recruit however.  It just seems in Australia we don&#8217;t have two dominating law schools as a function of a different geograpical and jurisdictional situation.</p>
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		<title>By: &#187; Searching for Inspiration at Halo Secretarial Blog -</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-931&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-931</link>
		<dc:creator>&#187; Searching for Inspiration at Halo Secretarial Blog -</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 04:22:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-931</guid>
		<description>[...] ago, but it caught my attention in my reader tonight nonetheless and is well worth sharing today: The best and the brightest comes from Jordan Furlong at Law 21 and is in my mind a truly thought-provoking post that I wish [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ago, but it caught my attention in my reader tonight nonetheless and is well worth sharing today: The best and the brightest comes from Jordan Furlong at Law 21 and is in my mind a truly thought-provoking post that I wish [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Omar Ha-Redeye</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-928&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-928</link>
		<dc:creator>Omar Ha-Redeye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:03:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-928</guid>
		<description>Thank goodness we don&#039;t have that kind of elitism in Canada.

Students at top-tier schools U.S. might be the best at writing the LSAT, or perhaps even cheating in school.  They are certainly not the best or the brightest, and as most practicing attorneys will tell you, the best lawyers come from all kinds of unexpected places.

The reality is that Scalia is using the same method that most law firms use.  They get so many applications that it&#039;s easier to set thresholds and stratify within a more selective group than to search through piles of paper for some real talent.

Maybe, just maybe, one day SCOTUS will review an online resume or blog writing as part of their application.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank goodness we don&#8217;t have that kind of elitism in Canada.</p>
<p>Students at top-tier schools U.S. might be the best at writing the LSAT, or perhaps even cheating in school.  They are certainly not the best or the brightest, and as most practicing attorneys will tell you, the best lawyers come from all kinds of unexpected places.</p>
<p>The reality is that Scalia is using the same method that most law firms use.  They get so many applications that it&#8217;s easier to set thresholds and stratify within a more selective group than to search through piles of paper for some real talent.</p>
<p>Maybe, just maybe, one day SCOTUS will review an online resume or blog writing as part of their application.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-927&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-927</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:12:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I don&#039;t think almost anyone, including Scalia, would argue that elite law schools justify their elite status mainly by doing a great job of teaching.  In fact, I have never heard anyone claim that elite law schools have great academic programs.  So Scalia&#039;s point isn&#039;t that he trusts the elite schools to teach well, but rather, that he trusts the elite schools to only admit very smart people.  Since the most important criteria for getting into an elite law school is having a high LSAT, Scalia is saying that he likes hiring people with high LSAT scores.  Although I am troubled by such a sentiment, I am not the least bit surprised by it.  It is well known that once a student is admitted to an elite school, he immediately has advantages over students who go to other non-elite schools, regardless of how well (or poorly) he performs at his elite school.   Indeed, while many big firms require candidates from non-elite schools to have been on the law review or moot court, candidates from elite schools are given a pass.  This seems backwards to me.  I know elite law school grads who coasted through school confident of the fact they would  get good jobs no matter what--and they were right: they did get good jobs.  It doesn&#039;t seem fair (or accurate) to me to assume that such a person is smarter or more capable than a hard-working, high-performing graduate of a non-elite school, especially when the grad from the elite school has already demonstrated a certain sense of entitlement and contempt for hard work.  Maybe it would loosen the grip of elite schools in the job market if candiates listed their LSAT score on their resumes.  This is certainly a crass idea since we like to pretend that things other than the LSAT matter, but by cutting to the chase, students with great LSAT scores could forgo the enormous cost of paying tuition at an elite school.  Of course, this wouldn&#039;t help people with mediocre LSAT scores at all.  Those people would remain screwed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think almost anyone, including Scalia, would argue that elite law schools justify their elite status mainly by doing a great job of teaching.  In fact, I have never heard anyone claim that elite law schools have great academic programs.  So Scalia&#8217;s point isn&#8217;t that he trusts the elite schools to teach well, but rather, that he trusts the elite schools to only admit very smart people.  Since the most important criteria for getting into an elite law school is having a high LSAT, Scalia is saying that he likes hiring people with high LSAT scores.  Although I am troubled by such a sentiment, I am not the least bit surprised by it.  It is well known that once a student is admitted to an elite school, he immediately has advantages over students who go to other non-elite schools, regardless of how well (or poorly) he performs at his elite school.   Indeed, while many big firms require candidates from non-elite schools to have been on the law review or moot court, candidates from elite schools are given a pass.  This seems backwards to me.  I know elite law school grads who coasted through school confident of the fact they would  get good jobs no matter what&#8211;and they were right: they did get good jobs.  It doesn&#8217;t seem fair (or accurate) to me to assume that such a person is smarter or more capable than a hard-working, high-performing graduate of a non-elite school, especially when the grad from the elite school has already demonstrated a certain sense of entitlement and contempt for hard work.  Maybe it would loosen the grip of elite schools in the job market if candiates listed their LSAT score on their resumes.  This is certainly a crass idea since we like to pretend that things other than the LSAT matter, but by cutting to the chase, students with great LSAT scores could forgo the enormous cost of paying tuition at an elite school.  Of course, this wouldn&#8217;t help people with mediocre LSAT scores at all.  Those people would remain screwed.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave!</title>
		<link>http://www.law21.ca/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&#038;feed=Comments+on+Articles+%28RSS2%29&#038;seed=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law21.ca%2F2009%2F06%2F12%2Fthe-best-and-the-brightest%2F%23comment-919&#038;seed_title=The+best+and+the+brightest%3F/comment-page-1/#comment-919</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 02:42:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.law21.ca/?p=890#comment-919</guid>
		<description>Yeah, I understood what he was doing, but it&#039;s a lot easier to ruin a silk purse than Scalia thinks; just wash it. The idiom works the way it does for a reason. Twisting it to make his point belies the same incorrect assumption he&#039;s making about what constitutes the &quot;best and the brightest&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, I understood what he was doing, but it&#8217;s a lot easier to ruin a silk purse than Scalia thinks; just wash it. The idiom works the way it does for a reason. Twisting it to make his point belies the same incorrect assumption he&#8217;s making about what constitutes the &#8220;best and the brightest&#8221;.</p>
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